Curse

Numa Pompilius · Nov 23, 2008, 09:26 PM // 21:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Striken7

We know most of those copies are bought by people who already have an account.

No. We do not know that. You're simply assuming so based on nothing.

Quote:

And yet they are reporting 5.59 million accounts created.

Which, I'd say, shows one should be very careful about confusing reported sales figures with reported accounts created.

moriz · Nov 23, 2008, 09:39 PM // 21:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winterclaw

When you can't beat them fair and square, beat them in court: sue blizzard for being a monopoly and break them up.

and jeopardize my precious starcraft II? never. go burn in hell for even suggesting it

EPO Bot · Nov 23, 2008, 10:30 PM // 22:30

It's not that Blizzard actually takes steps to stop other developers from making a better game. So dream on.

Zinger314 · Nov 23, 2008, 10:35 PM // 22:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winterclaw

When you can't beat them fair and square, beat them in court: sue blizzard for being a monopoly and break them up.

You can't "sue" people for being a monopoly; it's regulated by the FTC.

And it would only be a monopoly if it WoW was the only online game in existence. Which...wouldn't happen.

-Sonata- · Nov 24, 2008, 01:06 AM // 01:06

Just to expand on the thought:

Blizzard isn't putting others out of business either. Well, directly, anyways. Games that don't succeed, lose a high % of their initial playerbase within 6 months, or eventually close down (TR, recently Hellgate as well) are directly at fault to the games developers.

I've stated many times and firmly believe it to be true; Produce and push to market an unpolished, not-ready game and it will fall. Create a product with minimal bugs and glitches (That don't hinder game play) and it will have a long lasting life. That goes for the F2P market and P2P. While WoW has had a long life so far, so has Lord of the Rings (which I recently subscribed too after eating my foot and realizing it's a great game), City of Heros, and Linage to name a few. All of which are really fine tuned. Aion, I predict, will also be highly successful judging by the amount of development time and beta testing periods it has been and will be going through.

F2P market has long time successes as well. Flyff is highly successful and proved if you provide a cash shop that is like a clothing mall, people will pay to dress themselves up.

Point being is you don't have to tackle World of Warcraft to be successful in the market. You just have to put something out there that says, "I'm worth it" and something that doesn't feel so fragile, or becomes unplayable due to bugs and glitches that should never have been a part of a release.

Snow Bunny · Nov 24, 2008, 05:59 AM // 05:59

Richard Garriot is a dickhead

aapo · Nov 24, 2008, 06:14 AM // 06:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

It is probably also possible to perhaps not beat but at least carve a niche alongside WoW by catering to a different crowd. It is, for instance, very easy to provide much better graphics, physics, and game mechanics than WoW has, and that would attract hardcore gamers - a much smaller and more fickle market than the non-gamer market which is the base of WoW, but possibly sufficient to be profitable. Arguably this is what GW aimed for, and also arguably succeeded in doing.

- I wouldn't say that graphics, physics and all that make great games. It's something rather subjective called gameplay, which makes the game appealing. Think of Mario games. I'd still play the 8-bit Super Mario Brothers 3, because it's just the best design of the era. Other games of that time did not have features like map moving and inventory. It should be noted that some game companies of all eras have put their budgets on graphics. Graphics get obsolete, but good game design is something that has lasting appeal for decades to come. Why do people still play Starcraft? Will you play something like FEAR in five years when ordinary computers can play the game at max settings? I hope GW2 won't be basically GW with some additional bells and whistles like races.

strcpy · Nov 24, 2008, 06:49 AM // 06:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by aapo

I hope GW2 won't be basically GW with some additional bells and whistles like races.

I agree, but then I also hope it doesn't make GW the niche game that is.

WoW is near perfect for one segment of the market - and it is obviously a large segment. Many here argue (over three years after launch) that GW is a failure for all sorts of reasons - but three years later they are still here and are still turning a nice profit. Ouside of a large portion of gamers that have *no* business ability GW is a perfect example of a success. Indeed, outside of WoW there are few games that can compare (and beside WoW no game is a success).

For any company to compete with WoW is going to require something extraordinary. It will be that at some point WoW falls behind in technology (and since blizzard isn't stupid - they will put the same team on WoW2 and that will most likely be the bar to beat) but outside of that I do not see any real competition. Blizzard may very well make some bad decisions that open the door, but given their history I wouldn't bet that this would happen.

I think Anet realizes this and has carved their own niche out. Indeed - for their niche they are going to be hard pressed to be competed against. They have allowed a window (due to the amount of time between EOTN and GW2) but I do not see anyone out there really trying to fill it. WoW has such a market segment that most are tying (and loosing) for that venue. At some point many are going to realize that this is not a good venture and start seeking Anet's (the one really right below WoW).

As of right now GW has a nicely profitable segment that has no where else to go (I know I sure do not) - that (given that) they also produce a *good game* makes them hard to compete against. Given what I wrote above when there is competition to be had I like that no monthly fee will benefit us, not so much the producers.

GW2 will be most of what GW1 has carved out as a niche. If you didn't like GW1 I suggest you do not really give GW2 a go. You will not be happy - while they are obviously taking some of the more traditional MMO aspects and putting them in there, everything they have released so far is still GW1. If they go too far outside and try and compete in the MMO market then they will hit the WoW wall - that is they are so profitable that they are near insurmountable unless they screw up.

Red Sonya · Nov 28, 2008, 08:24 AM // 08:24

Thing is when a major like say Sony makes a non-monthly fee game with all the bells and whistles of a WOW you will see a mass exodus from all the pay to play and Guild Wars community. I say it again an again the MAIN REASON Guild Wars is popular is not because of the skill>time, but, because it has NO MONTHLY FEE. It's already been proven in polls if there was a charge to play GW's the majority of people wouldn't have bought it.

Lihinel · Nov 28, 2008, 09:51 AM // 09:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Sonya

Thing is when a major like say Sony makes a non-monthly fee game with all the bells and whistles of a WOW

And why the hell should they?

All those bells and whistles are expensive and there to keep the players playing and therefore paying.

Buisness model & game design go hand in hand, if not, your game is very likely to fail.
Either because there is nothing to keep the players occupied and paying the fee, or because you are not making any money.

(And don't mention Item shops, at the current state, they are no alternative model for big games. In the west, that is.)

Shadowmoon · Nov 28, 2008, 10:18 PM // 22:18

Gw has turned into a item shop model, so i can assume gw2 will have item shop elements. As long as item shop sells vanity and none essential upgrades, i will have no problem with the item shop model Anet is going in.

Lihinel · Nov 28, 2008, 11:16 PM // 23:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadowmoon

Gw has turned into a item shop model, so i can assume gw2 will have item shop elements. As long as item shop sells vanity and none essential upgrades, i will have no problem with the item shop model Anet is going in.

Ah sorry, that might be me making an error with the english words, I was refering to ingame item shops, games selling ingame items with adavantadges to paying customers.

It is a bit different with the current GW shop, as they mainly sell normal stuff like chapters, characterslots (and some items, but they dont give benefits and have been sold with normal editions of the game).
The only thing that might really count different are the PvPunlocks.

I don't see a problem with them selling chapters or mini expansion acks online, in fact that might be a good addition to the old model.
But I can't see them having to much succes with selling uber gear or stuff like Res or Exp Scrolls that are shop only.

weretoad · Nov 28, 2008, 11:40 PM // 23:40

simple fix. everyone working in city of H/V and there other games comes to guildwars. then get gw2 out on the market with in the year and make real money. it's genuis and we stay unbored.